That was the first full-length feature film I made - and the first picture with nude girls to get a censor's certificate. It was produced on a pretty low budget, and I've never known a film to make money so fast! People were queuing up solidly for months outside the Cameo-Moulin in Windmill Street where it was premiered. But really, it's the most innocuous film you can imagine! I saw it two or three years ago and it's hard to believe the sensation it created when it came out. But at that time, I had terrific battles with John Trevelyan (the censor) on certain scenes that were supposed to be too daring Not that there was any sex in the film at all. We had five rather lovely girls galloping about in long shot, but if I showed a nipple in close-up for more than five seconds Trevelyan would say "cut it, cut it!" The two films I've made for the British market since then (Naked World Of Harrison Marks and Nine Ages of Nakedness were quite a bit stronger, though they got past the censor without cuts. But I had some trouble with a film I did for America, Pattern Of Evil, which went through a nine month court hearing before it was passed for showing. It was a thriller with some sexy scenes and there was nothing really sensational about it compared with some of the movies you see in the States. Of course, when it finally got into the cinemas it made a fortune just on the publicity which was nice for the distributors, though I didn't see much of the money.
It's surprising that none of the British film people have financed you in a big way. I mean, none of your films have ever lost money at the box office, and yet the American director Russ Meyer (who started in sexploitation films and is now making big budget films for 20th Century Fox was really following a trend you'd already started. Seems as if the movie moguls over here are missing an opportunity.
It's the whole set-up in England. They're too cautious they don't want to take even the slightest chance with their money. I suppose you can't blame them in a way. The business over here is pretty much controlled by people who aren't film minded. They're in it strictly to make a profit - and they'd rather put their cash into a property which is safe and uncontroversial. But trying to explain the weird kind of thinking behind film production is impossible. It's an Alice-in-Wonderland scene. My last feature, Nine Ages of Nakedness, was a bomb at the box office. I made it on a tight budget but everyone who's seen it tells me it looks as if it cost thousands more than I spent on it. The reason? The cast, the camera crew and myself worked like crazy. We knocked ourselves out to give it quality in every department. But the big problem is finding private backers to put up the money. Okay, so you've had a big success. But they can’t be 100% sure it's going to happen the next time. So, they get cold feet.
Can we move on to your 8mm productions? Do you make these more or less single-handed - plot ideas, photography, editing?
I've got three assistants, and basically, they're put together from start to finish on a team basis. I usually come up with the ideas and handle the photography, but it's very much a group effort.
The big difference between your films and other 8mm nudie movies is the care that's taken in your productions. You obviously don't just stick a camera in front of some people and tell them to get on with it! They reach a very high professional standard.
Well, I've never counted the number of re-takes or cuts I make in my films before I'm satisfied. We shoot one of these fifteen or twenty-minute movies as if we were doing a feature film. Now, there's a lot of sex in these movies but there's also a story - a good situation, often with a comedy angle to it. Basically, the film is a build-up to a gag, a comic punchline. Once I've got the main idea I write a script around it. Then I hold discussions with my studio chief regarding the sets we're going to build the locations we're going to use. Then it's a matter of finding the actors and actresses to fit the parts.
Do you find some girls objecting to the kind of scenes you want them to play? Any inhibitions about simulating sex?
Let's put it this way: I'm a director, I've had a lot of experience and I think I've got the gift of being able to persuade people to do scenes they might not do for other filmmakers. And I never ask my actors to be anything diabolical! They see from the script that there's more to it than just tearing off their clothes and rolling around on a bed There's a comedy slant to the film, or there's a dramatic situation that appeals to them and I've never had trouble finding the right sort of people.
What about the other extreme? Have you ever had your actors getting carried away on the set and getting too involved?
This quite honestly has only happened once. Usually, everything's too professional, too business-like for any hanky-panky to get started between the actors. But this couple did get a bit naughty carrying on as if there wasn't a camera on them - and the whole thing was just a waste of time. I mean, you can't shoot this because of the legal situation, and even if you could do it, just letting two people go bloody wild is impossible because all you've got is arms and legs flying about!
This problem of knowing how much you are allowed to show: you obviously have to use your own judgement, but have you ever had a prosecution and defended your work in court?
Oh, yes, we had a case come up about four or five months ago. It had been pending for around two years before it finally got to court - and then we were cleared on all charges. After it was all over the foreman of the jury came over to me outside the court and congratulated me! He said he couldn't understand why the case had been brought up. (This was a film called Halfway Inn, a zippy, bawdy comedy, which the foreman said all the jury found very amusing and sexy without being offensive). And this is what my films are all about. I can only photograph the kind of material that turns me on - I don't mean I'm getting turned on while I'm behind the camera, but I know exactly what I'm shooting and it's the sort of erotica that I dig. Hard core pornography just leaves me cold.
All the same, would you give other people the freedom to see it if they wanted to? Are you in favour of abolishing censorship completely?
Yes, I'd certainly lift all the restrictions I dislike censorship intensely. The only thing is, once you abolish censorship you get such an influx of rubbish flooding the market. Maybe this would only be a temporary thing, but it makes a lot of people think twice about following the example of Denmark, for instance, where ninety percent of the material is cheap and crappy. Mind you, you've also got to provide a few safeguards - this has been said a thousand times before but it's worth repeating. Don't push it under people's noses - don't let the suburban newsagents plaster their windows with raw sex. But this is the only restriction I'd want to see. For those who want to buy pornography - okay, there it is, but don't force people who aren't interested in it to look at it. You can sell this sort of material discreetly if you want to. For instance, there are sex shops in London now - not selling pornography, I'm not talking about those hole-in-the-wall alleyway shops in Soho - but high-class sex boutiques like Ann Summers and Lovecraft which are very beautifully arranged. They don't fill their windows with sex aids. If you want them, you go inside and browse around. But they should be able to sell the whole range of sexual material, and if a man wants to go in and buy porno books and films, why shouldn't he? I mean, he's not going to come out and run amok down the High Street showing it to all and sundry, is he?
Going back a few years, you launched two magazines, Camera and Solo, which were very successful. But lately you've been concentrating on films and neglecting still photography.
The truth is that I'm bored to death with shooting stills. I was a very dedicated photographer, but that kind of work doesn't interest me too much. It's more of a challenge, more stimulating to make movies. I tend to work in bursts of inspiration on films - in January I've got fourteen new productions coming out. Thad some great ideas for stories and a lot of really good models started coming along for auditions. So, I've been working pretty solidly. But as I said, it's got to be material that I think is fun, that I think people will enjoy. Now, six months ago someone came to me with a very, very good offer. He wanted me to make some homosexual films; not porn, you understand, just scenes of beautiful guys in muscle-man poses. So, I thought about it - but I decided that I couldn't shoot that kind of film if they gave me a thousand pounds a day! Because I wouldn't know what I was looking for. I may be missing out, but there's nothing in that scene that turns me on, which means that I can't shoot it.
What's your own personal favourite among the 8mm films you've made?
